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    Not Everyone Carrying A Gun Is A Shooter

    The insanity continues.

    De Blasio Doesn’t Get It. Not Everyone Who Carries a Gun Is a Shooter.




    A model Brooklyn program to keep young people out of jail runs afoul of the mayor and the police.
    Emily Bazelon
    By Emily Bazelon
    Ms. Bazelon, a staff writer at The New York Times Magazine, is the author of “Charged: The New Movement to Transform American Prosecution and End Mass Incarceration.”


    Mayor Bill de Blasio took a break from his long-shot presidential campaign this week to attack a program in Brooklyn that keeps young people who’ve been convicted of having an unlicensed gun out of prison. It was a strange move. Brooklyn’s diversion program is doing good, not harm, the evidence shows. It’s an effort the mayor could showcase on the national stage, an example of the city’s success at incubating reforms.

    But at a news conference on Monday, Mr. de Blasio sounded anything but visionary.

    The trouble started when the New York Police Department chief, Terence Monahan, suggested at the same gathering that the blame for a rise in shootings so far this year lay with plea deals in Brooklyn “that result in little or no jail time.” It’s true that a small fraction of young people charged with illegal gun possession in Brooklyn — but not for shooting anyone or even brandishing a gun — are accepted into a yearlong program, run by the office of District Attorney Eric Gonzalez, called Youth and Communities in Partnership, or Y.C.P. Participants meet weekly with a social worker, adhere to a curfew, and must work or take classes and complete dozens of hours of community service. If they graduate from the program, they are spared prison and the burden of a felony record.

    Y.C.P. offers a narrow escape hatch from New York’s punitive gun laws, which are among the harshest in the country. The state imposes a 3½-year mandatory minimum prison sentence for people who are convicted of the maximum charge for possessing a loaded gun without a license. In some states, possessing a gun without a permit isn’t even a crime. Other states treat the offense as a misdemeanor or make exceptions for having an unlicensed gun in one’s home. But in New York, gun control has taken a form that includes mandatory prison sentences.

    The New York Police Department has long credited “Guns = Prison,” as the slogan goes, for much of New York’s amazing crime drop. And it is amazing: Crime has fallen steeply in New York over a quarter century, to a level not seen since the 1950s. In 1990, there were 2,245 killings in the city. In 2018, there were fewer than 300.

    Yes, there is evidence that civil laws requiring gun permits reduce gun deaths. But it’s much harder to find the same effect for mandatory prison sentences. Eighty percent of New York City’s drop in homicides happened before the strict mandatory sentences for gun possession went into effect in 2006. Researchers have failed to find evidence that compulsory prison time for gun possession resulted in a drop in violent crime in Florida, Virginia, Massachusetts and Chicago.

    No Y.C.P. graduates or participants are suspects in any of the shootings. Mr. Gonzalez said gang members are shooting each other, and his office points out that two-thirds of homicides and shootings in north Brooklyn are unsolved. “When the police make those arrests, the number will drop,” Mr. Gonzalez said at a news conference of his own this week. He was there to announce the charging of 21 alleged gang members in connection with two murders and three other shootings.

    In my reporting for my book, I watched young people benefit from Y.C.P.’s oversight — the impetus that they get a job or complete school, and most of all, from working with skilled and dedicated social workers who helped them build a more solid foundation for their lives. A few participants expressed regret when their year in the program ended, because they’d be losing its support. One texted his social worker: “I just wanted to say thank you for everything you did for me. Not a lot of people care what happens to anyone and you made sure I was on the right path to the future.” He’s now a sophomore at Kingsborough Community College.

    Y.C.P. started in 1997, in partnership with some Brooklyn churches, out of a recognition that “not everyone who carries a gun is a shooter,” as Anthony Newerls, who runs a violence-prevention program in Brownsville, told me. “In many cases, we see the carrier is carrying the gun for someone else.”



    Last edited by spider; 07-12-2019, 01:50 PM.

    #2
    So from what I gather, gun control doesn't work?

    Comment


      #3
      Gun control never works never will you can take all the legal guns away but the criminals will always have them. I carry everyday with a business permit for a business thats open 24/7, what I've found with myself and several others is you become much clarmer knowing you have a firearm and can end most any threat presented to you.
      stay alive, carry a 45

      Comment


        #4
        This actually seems like a great program.

        Comment


          #5
          Yes, there is evidence that civil laws requiring gun permits reduce gun deaths.
          I'd like to see the deep data behind this.

          I bet the reductions are in already very heavy shooting/murder areas. No way to test if it has prevented a shooting somewhere such things are less occurring.
          I am not armed out of fear of who's in front of me.
          I am armed out of love of those behind me.

          Anyone who says money doesn't matter to them is either a FOOL or a LIAR or BOTH!

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Airbrush art View Post
            Gun control never works never will you can take all the legal guns away but the criminals will always have them. I carry everyday with a business permit for a business thats open 24/7, what I've found with myself and several others is you become much clarmer knowing you have a firearm and can end most any threat presented to you.
            Yup, in my new home state carry is a way of life, and you find yourself staying away or moving away from possible confrontations
            Take a young person shooting.... Take 2 or more if you can...

            Comment


              #7
              I seems ironic that liberal deBlasio did not come out in full support of the program for kids like Dante. It sounds like a program he would strongly support.

              I don't know enough about the program to know if it is working or not. I would not be adverse to the program if it turns around young teens without violent records headed in the wrong direction.

              I would support it being applied to foolish out of state travelers who show up at JFK with firearms. Stupidity should not result in mandatory sentences.

              ANY violation by ANY person of ANY provision of this section is a class A misdemeanor. - NYPL §400.00(15)
              Conspiracy in the sixth degree is a class B misdemeanor. - NYPL §105.00

              Comment


                #8
                Just exceptional craziness, clearly begins with the agreement that the murder rate in NYC went from something like 2,400 city wide in 1990, to about 300 last year, largely because the NYPD and the City have instituted a policy where carrying an illegal gun is a jailable offense.

                Also in the article it acknowledges that murders in NYC are rarely solved, likely because gang bangers don't rat each other out, they just get revenge.

                Immediately after agreeing that the City is safer when they lock up gun toting criminals, the writer states that the City and especially De Blasio is wrong for having this policy. The writer makes the argument that NOT jailing (mostly black) young men is better in the long run (better for the criminal), let's forget the fact that more people will die.

                What she is saying is: The perp is the victim, the victim is irrelevant.

                Where have we heard that before ?




                LI Ammo, 2 Larkfield Rd. East Northport, open seven days

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by LI Ammo View Post
                  Just exceptional craziness, clearly begins with the agreement that the murder rate in NYC went from something like 2,400 city wide in 1990, to about 300 last year, largely because the NYPD and the City have instituted a policy where carrying an illegal gun is a jailable offense.

                  Also in the article it acknowledges that murders in NYC are rarely solved, likely because gang bangers don't rat each other out, they just get revenge.

                  Immediately after agreeing that the City is safer when they lock up gun toting criminals, the writer states that the City and especially De Blasio is wrong for having this policy. The writer makes the argument that NOT jailing (mostly black) young men is better in the long run (better for the criminal), let's forget the fact that more people will die.

                  What she is saying is: The perp is the victim, the victim is irrelevant.

                  Where have we heard that before ?




                  Excellent analysis. That's what I got out of it.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Cook county Illinois,has similar strict gun laws. South Chicago , I would honestly say that more people were shot in South Chicago last week that all of Afghanistan.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by mickeyblueyes View Post
                      Cook county Illinois,has similar strict gun laws. South Chicago , I would honestly say that more people were shot in South Chicago last week that all of Afghanistan.
                      Chicago crime map today.
                      It's bedlam.

                      Printed on the page "Too many incidents to plot.".



                      See crimes, incidents and sex offenders in Chicago, IL on CrimeReports

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by pandm View Post

                        Chicago crime map today.
                        It's bedlam.

                        Printed on the page "Too many incidents to plot.".


                        Chiraq.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by LI Ammo View Post
                          Just exceptional craziness, clearly begins with the agreement that the murder rate in NYC went from something like 2,400 city wide in 1990, to about 300 last year, largely because the NYPD and the City have instituted a policy where carrying an illegal gun is a jailable offense.

                          Also in the article it acknowledges that murders in NYC are rarely solved, likely because gang bangers don't rat each other out, they just get revenge.

                          Immediately after agreeing that the City is safer when they lock up gun toting criminals, the writer states that the City and especially De Blasio is wrong for having this policy. The writer makes the argument that NOT jailing (mostly black) young men is better in the long run (better for the criminal), let's forget the fact that more people will die.

                          What she is saying is: The perp is the victim, the victim is irrelevant.

                          Where have we heard that before ?



                          Dinkins, which is where this jackass is dragging NY back to
                          Take a young person shooting.... Take 2 or more if you can...

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by NRATC53 View Post

                            Dinkins, which is where this jackass is dragging NY back to
                            No, this shit show is gonna be a little bit crazier than Dinkins.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by spider View Post

                              No, this shit show is gonna be a little bit crazier than Dinkins.
                              It's got a million miles to go to be like it was back in the early 90's.
                              No Better Friend, No Worse Enemy

                              - U.S. Marines

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