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    #31
    I think they got the poly machine and Richter Scale mixed up at my test

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      #32
      As long as they don't ask about that night.....








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      LI Ammo, 2 Larkfield Rd. East Northport, open seven days

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        #33
        Originally posted by Barnslayer View Post

        My opinion, honest people answer honestly. Some dishonest people may still lie. But the ones you want to catch the most.... will lie and it won't phase them to be hooked to a polygraph machine. They feel nothing. They've done it all their lives. They are morally bankrupt. Many of them get elected to office.
        If they're trying to deceive and not get caught or found out, with the vast majority of people, their physiology changes. Some of these changes are not perceptible to the investigator's eye or ear (speech), so the machine can pick up on some of it.
        As you say, possibly some career criminals can control their internal physiology during questioning, but I think that's a very small percentage of them and the OP is probably not in that category while trying to became a PA Trooper.

        I'd be careful how I answered questions for a job if I knew I'd be hooked up to a polygraph and possibly asked those questions again. While polygraphs generally can't be used in court, I'm not sure if a 'deceptive' result could lead to someone not getting a job, or does that just tell the investigator to dig deeper into that area of his investigation.
        Last edited by Dan 0351; 10-02-2019, 10:24 AM.
        "The Open Carry guy is my decoy."

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          #34
          Dan, and OP, (Barnslayer will not be convinced anyway) the point about the deceptive result being a "lead" and not the end result, is spot on. When it came to DoD, a deceptive result, but without the usual subsequent confession, would simply be given over to another group of adjudicators, who would include the poly result in their decision to grant or deny a high level security clearance. Guess which way that decision usually went ?

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            #35
            Originally posted by pequa1 View Post
            Dan, and OP, (Barnslayer will not be convinced anyway) the point about the deceptive result being a "lead" and not the end result, is spot on. When it came to DoD, a deceptive result, but without the usual subsequent confession, would simply be given over to another group of adjudicators, who would include the poly result in their decision to grant or deny a high level security clearance. Guess which way that decision usually went ?
            That was my experience in a nutshell.
            I didn't even care that I failed, I found out after the fact that the job sucks and nobody sticks it out anyway.
            I also found out that certain organizations have a substantially higher fail rate, which makes me suspicious that the polygraph isn't just a polygraph but rather a component of a greater psych eval.

            I was however annoyed off that my recruiter, liaison, and investigators, and all the written correspondence told me that it would take up to four hour, and it turned into nine, without a meal break.

            As far as I've heard, if your results get submitted to OPR for further review, 99% of the time it will return as a fail.
            The other 1% is a re-test which I would argue is just barely better than a fail.

            It's all the same, we're all ashamed of our children who can't read between the lies of their textbooks
            This world must bear witness to a revolution every now and then
            We clutched our quills to scribe the bills of this great nation
            Now show me you can hold a fucking pen

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              #36
              Originally posted by pequa1 View Post
              Dan, and OP, (Barnslayer will not be convinced anyway) the point about the deceptive result being a "lead" and not the end result, is spot on. When it came to DoD, a deceptive result, but without the usual subsequent confession, would simply be given over to another group of adjudicators, who would include the poly result in their decision to grant or deny a high level security clearance. Guess which way that decision usually went ?
              Maybe you missed my point (Dan got it). If professionals can be trained to fool the test it has a margin of error. And with any test based on physiological/emotional responses, there is the risk of a false positive. Furthermore, any such test has a human element regarding its administration. Being questioned in a courtroom or taking a skillfully worded survey can steer results in a predetermined direction. I would think the same holds true for a polygraph.
              Exercise the Bill of Rights. It's good for your Constitution.

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                #37
                Originally posted by Barnslayer View Post

                Maybe you missed my point (Dan got it). If professionals can be trained to fool the test it has a margin of error. And with any test based on physiological/emotional responses, there is the risk of a false positive. Furthermore, any such test has a human element regarding its administration. Being questioned in a courtroom or taking a skillfully worded survey can steer results in a predetermined direction. I would think the same holds true for a polygraph.
                The ole' 'stick a thumb tac in your shoe and before answering any question. stick yourself with it"? LOL
                "The Open Carry guy is my decoy."

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                  #38
                  Originally posted by Dan 0351 View Post

                  The ole' 'stick a thumb tac in your shoe and before answering any question. stick yourself with it"? LOL
                  Look here, the investigator had to re-do the "control questions" several times throughout my exam and I have a sneaking suspicion his readings got really fucked up about the same time my stomach growled at various points towards the end of the exam. In hindsight I probably should have told him I can get hangry on occasion.

                  He literally told me "I'm getting some really strange readings in areas that I am confident you are being truthful in"
                  It's all the same, we're all ashamed of our children who can't read between the lies of their textbooks
                  This world must bear witness to a revolution every now and then
                  We clutched our quills to scribe the bills of this great nation
                  Now show me you can hold a fucking pen

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by viper720 View Post

                    Look here, the investigator had to re-do the "control questions" several times throughout my exam and I have a sneaking suspicion his readings got really fucked up about the same time my stomach growled at various points towards the end of the exam. In hindsight I probably should have told him I can get hangry on occasion.

                    He literally told me "I'm getting some really strange readings in areas that I am confident you are being truthful in"
                    Translation.......”this is my first time operating this thing and I have no idea what I’m doing. Hell, this test was only supposed to take four hours.......”

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by Dan 0351 View Post

                      The ole' 'stick a thumb tac in your shoe and before answering any question. stick yourself with it"? LOL
                      That's Hollywood, though the idea of distraction makes physiologic sense. In school we were taught of the Gate theory of pain. The idea being your brain will choose one distraction/pain thus blocking another. A gadget came out to do this during dental procedures as a replacement for the usual injected anesthetic. Electrode patches placed in the mouth wired to a hand held controller sent an electric current to the area needing work. The patient held the controller and could increase the intensity as needed. Besides too many patients dialing it to 11 (some claiming they saw colored lights ) the current caused excessive bleeding and never caught on.

                      Another came out with an vibrator (yes) the shape of a cigar tube. A rubber Y-shaped end is place into the mouth and push it against the gums. Then you take your usual syringe and place the needle between the two arms of the Y.
                      The vibration distracts your body so you don't feel the needle. This actually works.
                      Exercise the Bill of Rights. It's good for your Constitution.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by Barnslayer View Post

                        That's Hollywood, though the idea of distraction makes physiologic sense. In school we were taught of the Gate theory of pain. The idea being your brain will choose one distraction/pain thus blocking another. A gadget came out to do this during dental procedures as a replacement for the usual injected anesthetic. Electrode patches placed in the mouth wired to a hand held controller sent an electric current to the area needing work. The patient held the controller and could increase the intensity as needed. Besides too many patients dialing it to 11 (some claiming they saw colored lights ) the current caused excessive bleeding and never caught on.

                        Another came out with an vibrator (yes) the shape of a cigar tube. A rubber Y-shaped end is place into the mouth and push it against the gums. Then you take your usual syringe and place the needle between the two arms of the Y.
                        The vibration distracts your body so you don't feel the needle. This actually works.
                        Another theory I've heard is that pain and sexual arousal are processed in the same parts of the brain, so think about tits before you get punched and it won't hurt as bad.

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                          #42
                          Originally posted by Exonautic View Post

                          Another theory I've heard is that pain and sexual arousal are processed in the same parts of the brain, so think about tits before you get punched and it won't hurt as bad.
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                          Exercise the Bill of Rights. It's good for your Constitution.

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